Grout filling a Clevo! Streetable car or strip weapon?

Tiapan · 16-04-2006, 06:26 PM

my 393 is half built, my engine builder Graham Stone says to grout fill the water jackets to the bottom of the welsh plugs....
my conditions were,
1. car must be streetable
2. runs on pump fuel
3. reliable bottom end
4. big torque

(1) does anyone know of the disadvantages and advantages of grout filling?
(2) is there a better amount of grout filling (i.e. less or more grout for street driving)

**Falcon Coupe** · 16-04-2006, 07:20 PM

It will run a little hotter with the groutfill, that's the only downside, Brenx is the one to speak to, he has a grout filled 393 streeter, his AU twin thermo fans keep it all under control, pump fuel it run's low 11's @124mph.
What transmission will you be putting all that torque through ?

tufLTD · 16-04-2006, 07:38 PM

Oil temp is more of an issue than water temp in grout-filled blocks. You may need to fit an oil cooler.
Most are grout-filled up to the water pump outlets.
Have you sonic-tested the block?

brenx · 16-04-2006, 08:02 PM

Question is how often do you want to drive it and do you realise what it costs to fuel it?

Reliability is simple, pump fuel simple, big torque (depends on your defination of big torque). With the right spec'd engine you will achieve exactly what you want.

Do the grout partial fill as it protects the cylinders. It's a safely measure.

Tiapan · 17-04-2006, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brenx

Question is how often do you want to drive it and do you realise what it costs to fuel it?

Reliability is simple, pump fuel simple, big torque (depends on your defination of big torque). With the right spec'd engine you will achieve exactly what you want.

Do the grout partial fill as it protects the cylinders. It's a safely measure.

Thanks Brenx, it will be the weekend crusier, (just foreshore cruises, dates, ect)
every so often i would like to drag it as the quit motorplex is 5 minutes from my house,
im not sure about torque but my exact engine driveline quote was used on 2 xe falcons recently, one replaced my solid roller with a hydralic cam and made 590hp with the same CHI heads as me
the other had the same cam specs but used KEC CNC ported 2v heads (probally the best heads availible but costs 2500 just for the port job)
this xe made 620!
this guy ran in his 620 motor (sideways) and 2 nights later ran a 10.30 and then entered the burnout comp the same night and shot the tires off the rims to win 1st place.
we all have c4s with 3800 stallies,
custom veem thickwall tailshaft and 9inch with billet centre and 31 spline axes

so brenx what is your fuel economey like?

xbcool · 16-04-2006, 08:18 PM

gday
I also run a 393 built by pavtek motor is being set up for efi,
it only runs a 16inch thermo on engine side of a 4 row desert cooler radiator
will this keep it cool
it made 530hp @ 6200 490fptq

dynosteve · 17-04-2006, 11:23 AM

Grout doesn't mean the engine will run hotter nor do you need a engine oil cooler(however a engine oil cooler does increase the life of a motor), i have run grout in all my race and street engines (clevelands) for over 15years now, you will need a good cooling system, decent radiator and electric water pump is a good advantage, engine tuning mixtures must be spot on and not to much initial timing or too give a aggressive advance curve in the distrubitor. However only grout up to the welsh plugs maximum.

brenx · 17-04-2006, 11:44 AM

$2500 to make an extra 30hp? I guess it show's how good the heads were to start with.

I'm just shy @ 588hp but are only using a solid flat tappet camshaft. A roller camshaft would be better through out the rpm range. Basically everything off the shelf nothing massaged apart from the cam it is the slightest amount fiddled with and the block is grouted. Pavtek called it a low fill. I vaguely remember they stating they grouted it to where dynosteve stated.

Not really sure on fuel economy as yet. I've never put more than $50 in the tank. When I raced I used around 40lt with plenty of idling, driving around heathcote raceway and close enough to 20 pass's. I know, I've roughly put $1000 worth of fuel in it since Nov 05.

Rough guestimation with fuel @ $1.40pl I get around 150-200ish k's maybe? I'll get a better idea if I get to race @ Heathcote on May 20th. I'll be drving up, racing and driving back.

Tiapan · 17-04-2006, 12:18 PM

sweet, i just looked at your site and your motor is almost exactly like mine, how much did you pay?

nothing beats the rumble of your car in that video, when you stroked did it change the sound??

brenx · 17-04-2006, 12:24 PM

All my parts were brought over a 3 year period. I know a bloke with an XW that built the same engine for $16,000 with no carb. I'm 100% confident I could do it for less than that.

My short motor was done last year for roughly $6000 (machining/rotating assembly). I saved substancially by putting a lot of it together myself and already having the parts on hand.

Stroking made it louder. The video's of when it still had the 351.

Tiapan · 17-04-2006, 02:28 PM

yay im payin 14,000
because the apprentice took a chunk out of the bodykit reversing it out so instead of making them fix it i will do that when i paint it and they are gonna do my cooling and gearbox for free.
every part i got for ANDRA racers price even though i have no card, i think it was me constantly going in there with my hot girlfriend all dressed up in heels