Autonomous Emergency Braking

[Crazy Dazz]

These new rules highlight he ongoing problems with Chinese cars, and China in general.

On PAPER, they look really well equipped. Because they supposedly have all these great features.
But read the actual consumer reviews, and it's the same story repeated, over and over. These features don't actually work, and the dealers simply can't fix them under warranty.

It's the same reason nobody would buy an Acer computer. All the components are made in the same factories as HP or Dell, and on average they're probably just as reliable. But the issue has always been the Chinese Attitude to warranty.

The AEB on MGs (including SIL's) is notorious for being so-bad than many owners get it disabled.

Now contrast that with a company like Mitsubishi. They've actually yanked a bunch of vehicles off the market. The ASX, Eclipse Cross, and Pajero Sport.
From March, AEB becomes mandatory on all new cars. Whilst it IS available on these models, Mitsubishi has deemed that it does not fully comply with the new rules (which are based on American standards.)

So can we expect the Chinese to pull their POSs? Off course not, they'll just keep bull-shitting like they've always done.

We've had no end of problems on projects, with suppliers trying to deliver dangerous crap that doesn't comply with Australian Standards, or worse fails ANZ ESS. And when rejected, they just update the paperwork to claim that the manufacturer has self-certified it.
The best was a MV Switchboard, wired entirely with a single colour of 10A cable.

[kevino]

Yes
Ccp cars
There’s a hilarious review
Of the deepal s07 or some sort of odd of name
All the driver assistance stuff doesn’t work
Properly and is over assertive

It’s on news corp sites

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by kevino

Yes
Ccp cars
There’s a hilarious review
Of the deepal s07 or some sort of odd of name
All the driver assistance stuff doesn’t work
Properly and is over assertive

It’s on news corp sites

Found the review:

https://www.news.com.au/technology/m...0f7064d62b27f2

Sounds like a world of fun.

[MITCHAY]

For a long time I have just been about trying to keep my car going until I get a new car. But truth be told these days I'm thinking about trying to find a well kept old car to replace my current old car without all this crap

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

For a long time I have just been about trying to keep my car going until I get a new car. But truth be told these days I'm thinking about trying to find a well kept old car to replace my current old car without all this crap

Can recommend this, we faced same problem and probably will go this path for now.

The crappy AEB executions in some cars gives the vigilant driver something else to worry about, too - will that car in front of me actually turn in the filter lane? Will that car in front of me on the freeway grind to a halt when the concrete barrier at the off ramp is detected? Increased stopping distance is probably for the best now.

[OneMadMan]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

For a long time I have just been about trying to keep my car going until I get a new car. But truth be told these days I'm thinking about trying to find a well kept old car to replace my current old car without all this crap

Nodding...

That's exactly what I did. My TURD has a ciggie lighter and ashtray.
It has a very well setup traction control system, that can be disabled if you want to do a 'pedal / foot brake dance', but it's that well calibrated, it's better left on.
And that's it (ABS of course) as far as driver aids go. And I love it. Lets me do what I like to do. Drive.

As I have said in another thread, I put mine in the Toyota shop for some work, had a current Camry 4cyl ev thing for a loaner, and man, what a POS.
The EBS nearly put my face on the dash within the 1st 5 minutes of driving it.

Was driving on a wide industrial type estate 50kmp/h straight road.
Semi trailer parked on my left up ahead.

I can pass parked semi without leaving my 'lane / side of the road etc'.
4WD coming towards me in it's own lane keeping well left.

POS camry decides I'm gunna bend it, and puts my face on the dash...

HOW da fsck is this safe? It was dry, hot and sunny. Imagine that same scenario if it was wet, and old mate in the Valiant wagon was behind me... Crunch.

Not only did that take the cake, I had my window open while the a/c was getting up to temp (or down even) and I'm buzzing along minding my own bees wax... I gets a warning chime accompanied by a message on the dash that said: Your window is open, would you like me to close it?
Wow, I didn't realise it was open... SERIOUSLY??

Was on a narrow dirt road, wanted to do a handbrake turn. Cause if I didn't it would have meant a 3 point turn..
So slows to 30kays an hour, applies handbrake, turns steering wheel to the right expecting an old fashioned youi.. and man, I nearly ended up in a ditch, because it ABSed, beeped, whinged, and stalled the engine.. Yeah, thanks for that. NOT.

To many driver aids.
Did you know, in that same camry, when on cruise with radar assist, you don't have to drive it. It will slow down when approaching a car in front. It will speed up when it does, to the cruise speed you had set, it will EVEN come to a complete stop without any input from the driver. (IE, coming up to a red light from 110 kays an hour when the car in front slows to a stop).

Sorry, not a fan, never will be. It has taken my driving skills away from me by second guessing my intentions.

Don't get me started on the lane keeping assist thing GRRRR

/rant off.


Cheers,

One 'happy old car owner' Mad Man

[Captain Stubing]

There's no need to solely blame the CCP for this problem, we have a Thailand manufactured DMAX at work that freaks out and intervenes when I try to do some urgent driving. It's not ideal.

None of these systems will be foolproof, because they depend on the input of various sensors, which are effected by the environment they're driving into... mud/rain/debris etc.

[prydey]

If AEB is being activated perhaps the device between the seat and steering wheel is faulty.

[kevino]

Originally Posted by prydey

If AEB is being activated perhaps the device between the seat and steering wheel is faulty.

That’s a sharp comment
A faulty steering wheel attendant

[smoo]

Originally Posted by prydey

If AEB is being activated perhaps the device between the seat and steering wheel is faulty.

Nope,have had them shit the bed multiple times on a couple of examples.

Over taking and not indicating, not pulling out into the oncoming or passing lane early enough or when the speed differential between my vehicle and the one I’m passing is too great.

When someone infront of you is turning off and using a slip lane or the lane is wide enough for half their car and your car, you go or attempt to go around them staying within your lane, or you maintain current speed and road position knowing they’re going to turn in a couple of seconds, and it goes mental.

Far from ideal, especially the over taking manoeuvre where your attention is concentrated elsewhere and next thing the car is setting off all sorts of warning and starts to brake.

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by smoo

Nope,have had them shit the bed multiple times on a couple of examples.

Over taking and not indicating, not pulling out into the oncoming or passing lane early enough or when the speed differential between my vehicle and the one I’m passing is too great.

When someone infront of you is turning off and using a slip lane or the lane is wide enough for half their car and your car, you go or attempt to go around them staying within your lane, or you maintain current speed and road position knowing they’re going to turn in a couple of seconds, and it goes mental.

Far from ideal, especially the over taking manoeuvre where your attention is concentrated elsewhere and next thing the car is setting off all sorts of warning and starts to brake.

Yep that last situation you describe is the most concerning, surely putting on the indicator disables the system? Otherwise that is "death by oncoming road train".

[smoo]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Yep that last situation you describe is the most concerning, surely putting on the indicator disables the system? Otherwise that is "death by oncoming road train".

At a guess it doesn’t as even if the indicators are on and closing in on a truck with say an extra 30kmh and about to pass, the AEB would prob over ride.
Next time I have a rental car I’ll take more notice and see.

Another issue I’ve had, and I can’t remember what rental car I was in (maybe an I30), dual carriage way on cruise control passing a car who is in the LH lane.
The car I was driving randomly started to slow down to a slower speed of the car I was passing. Had this a couple of times.
Not a safety issue as the deceleration wasn’t extreme, more anyone behind me will be thinking WTF is this retard slowing down for.

[Sprintey]

AEB killed the ASX car

https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...running-models


Edit: I did not know this

"ADR 98/00 is based on United Nations Regulation No. 152, which requires autonomous emergency braking (AEB) systems to be able to detect another vehicle and apply the brakes if necessary at speeds of between 10 and 60km/h, and between 20 and 60km/h for pedestrians and cyclists."

So is this technology being stipulated by the UN for governments to enforce?

[Jack91]

Originally Posted by prydey

If AEB is being activated perhaps the device between the seat and steering wheel is faulty.

You've obviously never driven a dmax or bt50.
It'll freak out at nothing, and usually a second after you've already avoided the threat. And then the lane keeping tries to steer you back into it. Don't expect a quick power out of a sticky situation either, because of the built in 2-4 second delay, to the point of having to stall it up at busy roundabouts (but not too much otherwise it has another hissy fit). If it works and you get power, it'll spin the wheels then aswell, without the traction control doing a damn thing about it. It's total garbage.
I've heard the same from mates with other new cars too. Good ideas in theory, don't really work though.

Didn't ancap come out last year basically saying don't blame us because the driver aids are shitty and don't work properly?

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by prydey

If AEB is being activated perhaps the device between the seat and steering wheel is faulty.

Im sure that is the case on occasion but ive had the odd occasion where it detects a gaurd rail on a bend and thinks its going to hit it, even when well below the appropriate speed.

[kevino]

By Ccp I mean cars from China
A lot of the Chinese car Coys are owned by the Ccp Gov some are private

The Euros by review s seem to get these driver safety aids properly calibrated
Ccp and lesser extent Koreans struggle
I m not sure don’t know about Ram and GMSV
Ford I think also have their drivers safety aids well calibrated certainly my Puma is fine

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by kevino

Ccp and lesser extent Koreans struggle

Hyundai can't even get throttle response and cruise control to work properly, let alone AEB and some of the other driver AIDS modern cars are fitted with,

Cars peaked in 2017 when the VF Commodore was executed, everything since then has been a joke.

I'm like the modern equivalent of that person who said cars died in 1980 when they stopped producing the CM Valiant.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Cars peaked in 2017 when the VF Commodore was executed, everything since then has been a joke.

With the exception of VT onwards Holden and B series onwards Fords, demise of the car is when they stopped offering ash trays and cigarette lighters.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by smoo

With the exception of VT onwards Holden and B series onwards Fords, demise of the car is when they stopped offering ash trays and cigarette lighters.

Lets compromise and say up to the end of the VY where the best engine ever made (3.8L Ecotec) was discontinued.

BA/BF Falcon need not apply though

[smoo]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Lets compromise and say up to the end of the VY where the best engine ever made (3.8L Ecotec) was discontinued.

BA/BF Falcon need not apply though

I’ll rephrase.
With the exception of those models, anything without an ashtray and cigarette lighter isn’t worth owning.

[peaterj]

My MG4 has 3 settings for the AEB Low Medium High, i drive around on Low and it's ok not aggressive at all.

[kevino]

Mg 4 seems one of the better Chinese cars
As a separate thread
There’s a few of us here very interested in a comprehensive owners review of Mg4
Be good if you could post your comments on all aspects of mg4

[MITCHAY]

Yes the person between the steering wheel and seat is faulty. In times gone by they used their ****ing eyes! And ****ing mirrors too!

[prydey]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

In times gone by they used their ****ing eyes! And ****ing mirrors too!

Did they though?

[MITCHAY]

Even my WRX has a ciggie lighter and ash tray. I have used it less than a handful of times but it has been a backup

[XR Martin]

The reverse autonomous braking is even worse, slams the brakes on the same as if you actually hit something.
Scares the crap out of you when it's freaking out over just a tall weed.

I must say the AEB in a Pajero Sport was useful for me once, I was coming up on a crest and a car had stopped at the top because livestock was being hearded across the road. (It was a stupid spot for them to be crossing the road)
It gave an audible warning a split second before I noticed the vehicle. It didn't prevent me in having a crash as I saw it in time anyway, but in that instance I did appreciate it.

[XR Martin]

As for peak, I reckon the EL was my favourite.
Everything perfectly laid out, better quality materials than a BA and even my FGX in some areas.

[Dr Smith]

Two weeks before Christmas was rear ended after the following occurred.

5 cars in separate rh turn lane and I'm car #4 in the queue.
We all take off smoothly with reasonable distance between us. Cars #1 & 2 complete turn and drive away....

Car #3 suddenly breaks hard and comes to complete stop in the middle of the intersection. a Tesla 3.
My van (Vito) slams on it's brakes before I can react and skids to stop and car behind hits me...

Tesla drives off and as I realise what's happened cannot see anything that should have made the Tesla brake to an emergency stop...

Another driver not involved comes up and says "what the hell made the car in front of me brake suddenly?"

After this I turned my vans AEB to it's lowest sensitivity...no major damage as tow bar took some of the hit but other insurer will be billed $7000 from my insurer.

I think I could have avoided this as I probably would have braked later and not tried to come to a complete stop as did the AEB activation.

[simon varley]

but all these features are now part of ANCAP. Regardless of what the manufacturer claims, they are tested locally to get the stars.

For example MG3 gets 3 stars only. It scored only 58% for Safety Assist (10.62/18)

For AEB at junctions is scores 1/4
For AEB head on it scores 0/4
for AEB car to car it scores 3.54/4

the data is all out there. If people chose to ignore it in the pursuit of a cheap car then they shouldn't complain later.

[kevino]

Originally Posted by simon varley

but all these features are now part of ANCAP. Regardless of what the manufacturer claims, they are tested locally to get the stars.

For example MG3 gets 3 stars only. It scored only 58% for Safety Assist (10.62/18)

For AEB at junctions is scores 1/4
For AEB head on it scores 0/4
for AEB car to car it scores 3.54/4

the data is all out there. If people chose to ignore it in the pursuit of a cheap car then they shouldn't complain later.

Simon-where do you access that data.