Mowing ..

[yanknbank]

A update on the old Rover. It’s not quite as iconic as DFB’s Victa 18, but I still like my Rover 200 ESX. It’s a lot lighter to push around than today’s heavier push behinds with their safety bars and other ‘keeping you safe from yourself’ devices attached to various parts of the machine. And being a really basic 36 year old mower (had it since new) it’s also a lot easier to fix and repair to.



But it did let me down for the first time in ages the other day. I was half way through the mowing and emptying the catcher when it sort’ve just petered out and stopped from idle. Pulled it through a few times, and absolutely nothing. Didn’t even look like firing. Pulled the plug out and no spark.
Fortunately I bought a spares machine for $20 a few years ago and with no spark figured it was the ignition coil.
Swapped the coil across and also fitted the fan shroud/tinware from the spares machine. The shroud on my machine had ripped its bolt hole and wouldn’t bolt on square, so it rubbed on some of the rotating hardware. Even rubbed it back a bit and gave it a coat of paint! All done in 30 minutes. Simples! And it also looks a little bit cleaner with the fresh paint.
Anyway it’s running as new again and I’m looking forward to another 10 years of trouble free mowing!

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by yanknbank

A update on the old Rover. It’s not quite as iconic as DFB’s Victa 18, but I still like my Rover 200 ESX. It’s a lot lighter to push around than today’s heavier push behinds with their safety bars and other ‘keeping you safe from yourself’ devices attached to various parts of the machine. And being a really basic 36 year old mower (had it since new) it’s also a lot easier to fix and repair to.

image

But it did let me down for the first time in ages the other day. I was half way through the mowing and emptying the catcher when it sort’ve just petered out and stopped from idle. Pulled it through a few times, and absolutely nothing. Didn’t even look like firing. Pulled the plug out and no spark.
Fortunately I bought a spares machine for $20 a few years ago and with no spark figured it was the ignition coil.
Swapped the coil across and also fitted the fan shroud/tinware from the spares machine. The shroud on my machine had ripped its bolt hole and wouldn’t bolt on square, so it rubbed on some of the rotating hardware. Even rubbed it back a bit and gave it a coat of paint! All done in 30 minutes. Simples! And it also looks a little bit cleaner with the fresh paint.
Anyway it’s running as new again and I’m looking forward to another 10 years of trouble free mowing!

I have my eye out for one of those 80's Briggs, they still had the adjustable carb on them, so they would idle down so nice. And the alloy Rover base is indeed light but strong.

By the way, flip the air cleaner the other way around, the pointed part should fit the contours of the blower housing and be facing toward the starter rather than pointing outwards. Sorry, my OCD brain can't not see those little details.

[Interceptor]

Jesus H Christ Honda power equipment are hard to deal with.

Local dealer advises that the direct replacement has been discontinued and there are other motors of the same base model but different specifications..... but cant tell me the differences between them.

Even the non franchised suppliers seem to be of much help.

Honda Australia themselves? if they got any more useless, they'd be telling me to buy a cheap knockoff from china.

How hard can it be to have a chart listing engine models breaking things down by shaft size & length, and then which options?

Surely its not difficult to imagine that theres someone out there thats used a vertical shaft Honda engine for something other than a lawnmower?

All I need is a *genuine* Honda vertical shaft motor with a 25mm straight shaft that measures 80mm from engine mounting face to end of shaft.

Grrrrr.... about ready to tell my guy to go buy an electric mower like he's thinking about.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by Interceptor

Jesus H Christ Honda power equipment are hard to deal with.

Local dealer advises that the direct replacement has been discontinued and there are other motors of the same base model but different specifications..... but cant tell me the differences between them.

Even the non franchised suppliers seem to be of much help.

Honda Australia themselves? if they got any more useless, they'd be telling me to buy a cheap knockoff from china.

How hard can it be to have a chart listing engine models breaking things down by shaft size & length, and then which options?

Surely its not difficult to imagine that theres someone out there thats used a vertical shaft Honda engine for something other than a lawnmower?

All I need is a *genuine* Honda vertical shaft motor with a 25mm straight shaft that measures 80mm from engine mounting face to end of shaft.

Grrrrr.... about ready to tell my guy to go buy an electric mower like he's thinking about.

This one seems to have the shaft you are looking for -

https://sunshinecoastmowers.com.au/c...-gcv170-engine

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

This one seems to have the shaft you are looking for -

https://sunshinecoastmowers.com.au/c...-gcv170-engine

Its inly 7/8", so 22mm

[yanknbank]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

By the way, flip the air cleaner the other way around, the pointed part should fit the contours of the blower housing and be facing toward the starter rather than pointing outwards. Sorry, my OCD brain can't not see those little details.

DFB, I did try that a while ago when I first put that filter on the machine. When you turn it around, the filter housing doesn’t clear the vertical pull starter assembly. The original filter was of the paper element type which sat in a plastic housing on the upper handle bar. A snorkel ran from the housing to a horizontal plate sitting atop the carby, which it was screwed to supposedly sealing up the intake system. I don’t think it kept any dust out at all to be honest, hence the filter assembly change.
The briggs with the starter sitting on top of the fan housing wouldn’t of had that clearance issue and I think that’s where that style filter came from back in the day.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by yanknbank

DFB, I did try that a while ago when I first put that filter on the machine. When you turn it around, the filter housing doesn’t clear the vertical pull starter assembly. The original filter was of the paper element type which sat in a plastic housing on the upper handle bar. A snorkel ran from the housing to a horizontal plate sitting atop the carby, which it was screwed to supposedly sealing up the intake system. I don’t think it kept any dust out at all to be honest, hence the filter assembly change.
The briggs with the starter sitting on top of the fan housing wouldn’t of had that clearance issue and I think that’s where that style filter came from back in the day.

Rover were the only ones who used that specific snorkel arrangement on the 3.5 hp engines. For it to work well, you had to make sure the screw was TIGHT and that the gasket in place and in tact.

roversnor by D B, on Flickr

With the foam element air filters, there were two different housings, actually three.

For those older side-pull air engines, the metal housing is squarer with less chamfering around the edge.

old by D B, on Flickr

The newer engines from the early 90's have the pointier shape housing with chamfering around the edge. These were made in metal up to about the mid 2000's, then plastic. Looking at your engine, I'd say you have this style housing, which fits but not snuggly.

new by D B, on Flickr

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by Interceptor

Its inly 7/8", so 22mm

What about this one -

Shaft - 25mm diameter / 80mm long

https://www.hendersonmowers.com.au/p...specifications

[yanknbank]

Roger on all of that re the filters. Yup, mines the plastic one. I didn’t know that there was a metal filter housing for the 3.5 HP engines. I’ll have to keep an eye out for one of those, as that housing looks a little more ‘finished’ on the engine than what I’ve got.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by yanknbank

Roger on all of that re the filters. Yup, mines the plastic one. I didn’t know that there was a metal filter housing for the 3.5 HP engines. I’ll have to keep an eye out for one of those, as that housing looks a little more ‘finished’ on the engine than what I’ve got.

They started using plastic for the air filter housing when they switched to sourcing from China. You can identify the Chinese engines via the vertical ribs cast into the back of the block, the earlier 3.5's were smooth.

(I know, it's sad I know this shit)

[DFB FGXR6]

And you thought your battery powered lawn mower was something new.................

[DFB FGXR6]

Ordered a couple of specific Stihl tools, which are designed to allow adjustment to the carburetor tuning screws, bypassing the limiter caps.

https://www.outbushman.com.au/produc...-5910-890-2314
https://www.outbushman.com.au/produc...-5910-890-4500



Also included was a bottle of Stihl press fluid, which is designed to make installing gromets, fuel lines and filters easier. I learnt about this via the video below (from the 43-min mark), the idea of using this over oil is that press fluid evaporates away and prevents the fitting from popping off.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z6khZwwZ2s&t=182s

https://www.outbushman.com.au/produc...ne-fitment-etc



I also decided to give this foam air filter oil a try. Normally, I'd just use 30 weight oil, but its a messy job. This would be useful for old 3.5 - 4.0hp side-valve Briggs engines, as well as the newer entry level OHV Briggs with the primer bulb (300E, 450E and 500E) which have oil-soaked foam filters.

https://www.outbushman.com.au/produc...-all-machinery

[DFB FGXR6]

Wondering what I should do here.

When I rebuilt my beloved Sprint 375 last year, I noticed the breather tube was loose where it screws into the block. On closer inspection, and I have no idea how this happened, but the threads were gone.



This tube threads into the block behind the valve chamber and cover, directing crankcase pressure to the carburetor. Anyway, I decided to order a new one.







As I had expected, the threads in the block were gone as well, so the new part didn't tighten down.

Because of how the hole goes all the way through, I'm considering a helicoil to repair this installed from the valve cover side as access on the other side would be limited due to the coil/flywheel ect. With the valve cover removed, it wouldn't be depositing metal fragments into the block. I've also had someone suggest just using JB Weld or RTV to patch it back together.

Would love some feedback on this.

[Citroënbender]

If you’re comfortable with drill and tap a keysert/keensert type repair would be plenty strong enough.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

If you’re comfortable with drill and tap a keysert/keensert type repair would be plenty strong enough.

The tube doesn't need to be torqued down super tight, just needs to seal off the valve cover and prevent letting dust into the engine. It also can't be blocked off, which looks as if the Keyserts do?

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

The tube doesn't need to be torqued down super tight, just needs to seal off the valve cover and prevent letting dust into the engine. It also can't be blocked off, which looks as if the Keyserts do?

Keyserts arent blanked off at one end, so they'll suit your purpose

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by Interceptor

Keyserts arent blanked off at one end, so they'll suit your purpose

Excellent!

[DFB FGXR6]

So, what is the difference between Keysert and Helicoil? Is it just the branding?

[Citroënbender]

Keysert type thread repairs physically lock into the base metal by four integrated pins you tap flush. Helicoils rely only on gross friction.

[Citroënbender]

One point in favour of Helicoil type inserts, is you can get kits cheaply. That thread looks rather like a 3/8” UNF by pitch.

With Keyserts, you have to buy the drill and tap separately. (I’m fortunate, eBay tap and die seller “toolingstation” is not too far from my regular travels.)

[DFB FGXR6]

First job of the day and after two strips of lawn, the Rover locked up the rears, then wouldn't drive the right rear.............single wheel peel. I know I should have stopped to prevent potential further damage, or at least just pushed the mower, but this thing is just too heavy to push on thick and spongy Kikuyu. With only the one-wheel driving, I needed to both push and steer it straight. Luckily, I only had one lawn to do, so I limped it through and would look at it when I got home.

I've done this enough times now to be confident tackling a task like this. Remove the hub cap, remove the stupid wheel retainer washer, then slide the wheel off the axle.

The culprit? A slipped circlip, which caused the washer to pop off the drive shaft and the pawl going with it. One properly munted washer, the pawl looked fine, as did the circlip....................



And THIS is why I now have a healthy spare parts supply. In this case, all I did was replace the washer and circlip. Reassembled and tested, problem sorted.



On those wheel retaining washers Rover used, I hate them! They are a pain to remove, requiring you to mess about with a hammer and flat screwdriver lever them off the axle. This almost always breaks the stupid things, which means replacement. Then, you need that hammer again to beat the new one back on the axle with an old socket.

https://powermowers.com.au/products/...f097853c&_ss=r



Rover used those clips across the range, from the basic 18-inch steel deck base model, right up to the top of the range alloy deck 22-inch ProCut 560. While Masport also use them on the entry level machines, they switch to a threaded axle and nyloc nut for the high end and Contractor series. Victa use E-clips and on the steel chassis variants, and a combination of E-clips and wire M-clip on the alloy deck models. All preferable to those stupid tension washers.