Engine Damage - Run with Oil light showing for 2 minutes

[poppa smurf]

cant add anymore apart from wishing your youngsters the best of luck and I really hope no damage has been done to the engine.......

as for leaving oil on the highway I praise the gods above they got off in one piece

vehicles can be replaced but our loved ones are far too precious.......god knows what may have been if she wasn't watching the idiot lights....a seizure at highway speed and traffic would be unthinkable

[MrsLow006]

Ford Forums does it again - why am I not surprised about some of the comments on this thread. He posted for a bit of advice and gets it and more .......

[BadMax]

Seriously, you carry on like an oil analysis is the be all to end all engine wear questions. The car is some 15 year old heap with 200,000k+ on the clock, probably no service history...WTF do expect to find? A motor with a clean bill of health?

Trying to build eveidence against a mechanic who is bending over backwards just to try and slap him with a rebuild on a 200,000k car which is probably riddled with issues is just plain stupid IMHO.

How about she just gets the problem recorded, live with the car and if, and that is a big if something pops up deal with it then?

I'm not attacking you or your ideals, just stating the obvious. If you just want people to side with you don't ask for opinions on world wide webz bro...

[flooded one]

at least everyone involved was safe. it doesnt sound good what happened but i think you may get away with it. if the motor was being revved at 6000rpm or something stupid while it was lossing oil i'd be worried. i've seen some cars that suprisingly keep going with very little oil ( i dont recommend delibratly doing it) my uncles 202 powered commodore was an example. but being the tool he was he didnt care about his car so i'm suprised it lasted as long as it did. a friend of mine with an EL nearly ran out of oil and no oil pressure light came on. luckly her father found that one out for her. put new oil in it still runs well.

[blackf6]

Originally Posted by mash again

message to self, dont buy car from Teak81

I personally took that car to the wreckers.

[blackf6]

Originally Posted by teak81

I personally took that car to the wreckers.

I like your sense of humor though mate, had a good laugh.

[burnz]

having a drink are we teak?

rodge i think the bearing shells would have suffered, 2 minutes is a hell of a long time.
rings, boreliners no problem they can last 8 minutes but not the journals.

however can be hidden with a heavy oil !!

[wrongwaynorris]

Forget compression tests , NO reason to do one . The biggest problem will be damaged big ends and main bearings . Is their a hard mechanical knock under load ? Even if their isn't , 2 minutes with NO lubrication will definitely have damaged the big ends and mains . They are designed to operate in a film of oil which actually seperates them from contact with the crankshaft . I would be re approaching the mechanic and asking him to drop the sump and as a minimum regrind the crank and replace the big ends , mains and thrust bearings .

[gtxb67]

years ago, i was changing the oil in my datsun 120 why. at the same time i was replacing the starter motor. after refitting the starter, i reached in through the window and turned the key. for the first time ever it started on the first turn with no throttle. i turned it off very quickly, but the fact is it started and ran for a second or two without any oil at all. there were no problems with it after that

this is just a guess, but assuming the engine was warm, not started and very previously coated in oil - as long as it sounds and runs ok now, it could very well be ok

also, your daughter did well. not many people would turn the engine off just because of an oil light, but a lady . . . a young lady should be complimented for that

[BadMax]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

I would be re approaching the mechanic and asking him to drop the sump and as a minimum regrind the crank and replace the big ends , mains and thrust bearings .

Why? The motor has 200,000k+ on it, like the bearings are going to be in good condition. That'd be the biggest waste of time, money and effort when not doing the top end.
Drive it, if it blows crush the car or put a import motor in it with less than half the k's.

[Rodge]

Thanks for all the feedback, wow, quite a cross section of thoughts.
Rather sadly the average age of vehicles in N.Z. according to Govt stat's is 11.8 years. Vehicles here are however subject to a reasonably thorough warrant of fitness inspection regime every 6 months.

The age of my daughters car is not inconsistent with her peer group and it meets current WOF standards. Her boyfriend seized the engine in their last car by not checking the oil and with oil consumption... running it out of oil, he then claimed WTF ??? the engine oil light didn't come on.... the irony of this isn't lost on me. Now that I've been at them to check their oil level on a regular basis and get their vehicle serviced more often, this happens, hugely ironic I would have thought...

I think in the context of the value of the car the Mechanics approach has been fair and reasonable, (re-inbursing for the original night-time tow, organising a tow the very next morning to his workshop, new oil, filter, sump plug and complimentary replacement tyre) and this young couple take heart from the promise that if there's further problems to bring it back they'll look after them. They realise this vehicle is approaching its end of useful life so in the context of the circumstances are making plans to look at upgrading at some stage soon anyway, (not sure how soon, havn't spoken to them again today).

I think taking into account the overall cicumstances including the value of the vehicle and the satisfactory manner in which the garage have dealt with this so far, taking a wait and see approach seems an appropriate course of action at this stage. I agree with posts above its fairly likely the bearings have been compromised at least to some extent, how badly, not sure. In the meantime, next time I talk to them I'll encourage them to start saving for a better car. Have to conceed it would be nice to see them in a safer car. I'll have a conversation with my wife in due course about how and to what extent it is appropriate we might assist with that, (not looking for any feedback on that score Badmax) Thanks again for the feedback gents.

[Rodge]

Originally Posted by MrsLow006

Ford Forums does it again - why am I not surprised about some of the comments on this thread. He posted for a bit of advice and gets it and more .......

Thanks for that. Body armour can be a pre-requisite around here, sometimes having a thick skin just isn't enough Very grateful for the vast majority of comments, especially your's

[GT0132]

Originally Posted by MrsLow006

Ford Forums does it again - why am I not surprised about some of the comments on this thread. He posted for a bit of advice and gets it and more .......

My sentiments exactly......

[mcnews]

To steal something from my own bike forum that is a standard response to any tech question.....

"Trade It In"

:-)

[MAGPIE]

Rodge it seems the mechanic/workshop have done all they can (and more), good on them.

Given the value/age/km of the vehicle I wouldn't bother with oil testing, premium oil changes or anything else for that matter.

The money would be better spent on an upgrade.

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

all used vehicles are a lucky dip!!!!

same as a second marriage, really

i've seen cars that died as soon as they lost oil and i've seen cars that have run for hours with a dry sump and not suffered any problems. who knows what the deal will be?

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by Rodge

DashGT, Personally I can't a whole lot of mileage in overhauling a circa 15 year old car with 200,000 km's plus, if the motor is "cooked" its time for something more modern and safer, after all she carries around her daughter, (our precious and most delightful granddaughter) around in that car so the attraction of something safer with a decent air-bag count is certainly not lost on me. (Just like to get her teeth payments finished off first)

Davway, yes just confirming its the same shop that didn't do the sump plug up properly that have sorted the problem out today and are claiming there's no engine damage. Naturally I'm taking that assertion with a grain of salt.
I think this is a wait and see thing. Looking forward to having a chat with her this evening, will post comment on how the car appears to be running.
Used oil analysis in the near term continues to seem like a logical initial plan, at least in the first instance, assuming it appears to be running okay at present.

Sell the car and find a bunky for her to get around in......perhaps a S/C GT

[Rodge]

Knowing them, they'd kill themselves within a week, not quite the result I'm looking for but thanks for the humour, thread needed a bit

[Evgeni]

Originally Posted by aussie muscle

same as a second marriage, really

i've seen cars that died as soon as they lost oil and i've seen cars that have run for hours with a dry sump and not suffered any problems. who knows what the deal will be?

Many years ago a girl I worked with did a trip from Canberra to Syd in the work Hiace. When she arrived she asked me to check the car as a light was on....it was the low engine oil light. This car was hardly ever serviced and it just ran dry.
Filled it up with a thick oil and it ran fine. Lasted another 6 years before it was finally traded in for an upgrade, so you never know your luck.

[LOWAU]

It will be fine. The warning for low oil is just that, a warning. There would have still been plenty of oil in there.

My brother drives his work van with the oil light on and thrashes it in hopes of destroying it, it's till driving. One time when I jumped in it I saw the oil light on so I pulled into a servo and poured 1L of oil in there, to my suprise the oil light was still on.

[Trav199]

can you cut the oil filter? check for any excesive bearing material/metal.. be a quick way to see whats going on.. Obviously the 'incident' would have reduced the life of the motor some what but you may never have a problem with it..

[RASER]

I once saw a doco. with the sump plug and filler cap where BOTH removed, the car ran fine and no damage caused.

I think the repairer who left off the sump plug should give you a warranty on the engine only for XX months/km's as a goodwill and peace of mind situation.

[mik]

regardless of whether it has 200k on it or not it may or may not have lasted happily without a major problem for another 100/150k, every one makes mistakes , but the we usually pay for our mistakes in one way or the other, dropping the sump for bearing inspection to asses any damage sounds like a fair cop to me.

as a young buk i had a car lose it`s oil, i`d estimate it did`nt make 3 kilometers, not even 2 if i remember correctly , a guesstimate maybe 3 or 4 minutes without oil before it locked solid.

[ebxr8240]

High mileage cars are not worth much over there..
I would just drive till it stops , But keep it well serviced
till it does..
Btw you'll possibly get more as wreck than a trade in..
So just drive it.. They go forever treating them this way...
I suspect it's auto and as soon as you come off throttle the engine is almost idling.. If there's no bearing noise now ?? I highly doubt it will get worse...
If it has reasonable oil pressure now...

[J.C.]

Originally Posted by Trav199

can you cut the oil filter? check for any excesive bearing material/metal.. be a quick way to see whats going on.. Obviously the 'incident' would have reduced the life of the motor some what but you may never have a problem with it..

See post 30.

[Rodge]

Thanks gents for your continuing thoughts.
Those wanting to avoid reading about a frustrated father venting his spleen, please feel free to skip this post
Update 2 of sorts :-
My wife was over there this arvo and it appears the car has been running today exactly as it has done previously. They can't tell any difference before and after the event and they got a new warrant of fitness for it today, no drama's. Daughter was running around like a headless chook bleating that she couldn't find any cigarettes and that pay day tomorrow was forever away, (I didn't ask my wife if she brought daughter a pack, some things you simply don't want to know)....that got my wife and I talking over dinner this evening.

Gotta get this off my cheast, it really grinds my gears, so too speak. (Maybe it shouldn't..but it does).
We are both of view that they could easily afford a better car and it kind of annoys us they are driving their daughter, (our grandaughter) around in such an old car, although having said that it just qualified for a new warrant today so at least that's something. One thing that irks us both is the amount they waste each week between them on smokes, drinking and weed, from observation of how much they smoke we reckon they're blowing at the very least $100 per week on smokes between them, probably much more..they don't tend to smoke pot around us or drink excessivly but we know they do it so taking a stab in the dark we think they're probably spending something like $200 per week on what they see as "life's essentials" probably much more.

They could easily be paying off a far better car if they put their mind to it.
Adding insult to injury, They recently took in Joe's brother as a flatmate and he's paying half the rent, so they're getting another $140 per week coming in. Where's that extra money going...I'll give you 3 guesses.

Now I try and live and let live and not be judgemental, I really, really do...but I've worked bloody hard all my life to afford the sort of vehicles I have and when I look at their situation and how they're wasting money, (shakes head and bangs it against a brick wall) to me it begs the question of what assistance we should be giving if the custard hits the fan with this vehicle somewhere down the track.

Sure we'll help if required but we're not going out of our way to be overtly generous. he's 23 and she's just turned 20, IMO they've got plenty more growing up to do..(end of rant, sorry just had to get that frustration off my cheast).

Guess I'd better strap that body armour on again, just in case.
Felt good to have a good bleat, I feel much better now

[ea90gl]

I reckon the car will be fine, had oil lights come on a few times in cars only to discover there was a good 3 or so litres left in the sump, I believe its like the warning light for fuel level - they come on even though there is ten or so litres so you think your running on fumes and get to a servo asap. Not sure if it's been asked but did the cars temp start climbing? I had an old Mazda years ago that had a dodgy oil pressure switch (ofcourse I realised too late), the thing started overheating suddenly until I had to pull over. Checked the oil later and had virtually no oil - must of cooked some metal in there since once I refilled with oil it had a great big big end knock. If your daughters car is driving good with no odd noises I think it should be ok

[ebxr8240]

I have been in similar situ ..
I tell them in no uncertain terms to GET YA FREGAN ACT TOGETER !!!!
Dept is an issue too...

[Yellow_Festiva]

Don't worry Rodge... Your thoughts are the same as any other concerned parent / grandparent etc.

When I got married the wifes old Mirage became our 2nd car and I got her a demo Focus... At least if she has an accident I know I did my best!

Problem is... they are adults, and you need to allow them to make their own decisions. I wouldn't be giving them any more help other than verbal advice. They have the spare cash it seems, what they choose to do with it is up to them, as much as it pains you.

Good luck ;)

[pottery beige]

i drank and smoked heaps of pot when i was 20..

eventually i grew up..

/ can hold down job..

/ own my house..

/ have three GT's..

/ no more pot..

/ still drink heaps..