2010 Falcon/Territory (speculation) - Page 6

Road_Warrior · 06-02-2010, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Would explain a few things.

Well, come on...spill...

On another note, if Ford could find the cash to give the FGII(?) a little bit of a cosmetic makeover that would help them get the jump on Holden with the "still the same" looking VE update. Although I suspect that particular situation is going to be short lived.

**Fordman1** · 06-02-2010, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Would explain a few things.

Mmmmm.....

perhaps a towing capacity increase ?

Bossxr8 · 07-02-2010, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Mmmmm.....

perhaps a towing capacity increase ?

Rear floor mods.

Swordsman88 · 07-02-2010, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Rear floor mods.

Control blade stays still?? Surely we wont' see a new RWD IRS till GRWD??

phillyc · 07-02-2010, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Rear floor mods.

I hope to allow factory LiLPG fitment!

Falc'man · 07-02-2010, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

I hope to allow factory LiLPG fitment!

I think you're spot on. It's why Prado is quite popular, with good resale; it easily accepts LPG.

Swordsman88 · 07-02-2010, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

I hope to allow factory LiLPG fitment!

hmmm...wery inter...esting....

So maybe LILPG and diesel too? Is it confirmed Territory Turbo gets the cut for the new model??

**Fordman1** · 07-02-2010, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Rear floor mods.

Towing capacity increase .......

There won't be LiLPG in Territory..

Paxton · 07-02-2010, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elks

Im not in the loop, but you would expect that it would be may june, as the have to have euroIV compliant cars as of July 1. its unlikely they (or any other manufacturer) would introduce a facelift/new model to not coincide with this.

Really? This is exactly what BF was. A 'Facelift' to coincide with Euro III.

Swordsman88 · 07-02-2010, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Towing capacity increase .......

There won't be LiLPG in Territory..

Fair enough (ford has said no lpg territory before....like i noted maybe canabilise diesel sales anway.

BUT, then is the question, why would you go for more towing capacity? it tows what 2.4 tonne now, so unless surveys are showing people want to tow more then?? So increase it to 3tonne (anything less than that increase is not worth the investment...).

I don't get it unless the mod is very very simple/cheap and/or is part of a wider repositioning/model option RE diesel and possibly some sort of high rider kit for off road work. I suppose with diesel coming along ford thinks it can go after prado etc. owners that only use their cars for highway/gravel work but tow larger loads (e.g. caravans)....

jpd80 · 07-02-2010, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

Fair enough (ford has said no lpg territory before....like i noted maybe canabilise diesel sales anway.

BUT, then is the question, why would you go for more towing capacity? it tows what 2.4 tonne now, so unless surveys are showing people want to tow more then?? So increase it to 3tonne (anything less than that increase is not worth the investment...).

I don't get it unless the mod is very very simple/cheap and/or is part of a wider repositioning/model option RE diesel and possibly some sort of high rider kit for off road work. I suppose with diesel coming along ford thinks it can go after prado etc. owners that only use their cars for highway/gravel work but tow larger loads (e.g. caravans)....

I think it's a European design thing, vehicles less than 2.8 tonnes are restricted to around 2300 Kg towing,
that wouldn't work at all in the USA, I think they are much more lenient/practical with their light trucks.
Then again, fifth wheel trailers with turntables are much more common there, making towing much easier....

jpd80 · 07-02-2010, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

Really? This is exactly what BF was. A 'Facelift' to coincide with Euro III.

Hmm, there could be a face lift but maybe as you say, more like BA-BF rather than full sheet metal change.
Unless approved by head office on the grounds of more corporate shape, I doubt it would be allowed.

Swordsman88 · 07-02-2010, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Hmm, there could be a face lift but maybe as you say, more like BA-BF rather than full sheet metal change.
Unless approved by head office on the grounds of more corporate shape, I doubt it would be allowed.

Styling changes associated with bumpers etc. quite likely (though not guranteed this year) in the near future. Hardly see why ford needs to change any sheet metal...the FG is alot fresher than the VE and if you look at rival cars in the segment is holding up very well styling wise for its age. This was even mentioned by a reviewer recently (escapes me where i read it).

I think sheet metal changes will happen in 2011 with I4T (next new model...whatever its called). FG2 will just be bumpers/tailights or possibly nothing at all....just running changes. I think Ford will probably do something though just to combat any VF 'styling change' Holden may have planned for later this year (which is appearing increasinly likely as a non-metal change...save maybe bonnet....).

phillyc · 07-02-2010, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

Styling changes associated with bumpers etc. quite likely (though not guranteed this year) in the near future. Hardly see why ford needs to change any sheet metal...the FG is alot fresher than the VE and if you look at rival cars in the segment is holding up very well styling wise for its age. This was even mentioned by a reviewer recently (escapes me where i read it).

I think sheet metal changes will happen in 2011 with I4T (next new model...whatever its called). FG2 will just be bumpers/tailights or possibly nothing at all....just running changes. I think Ford will probably do something though just to combat any VF 'styling change' Holden may have planned for later this year (which is appearing increasinly likely as a non-metal change...save maybe bonnet....).

Last I heard, GMHolden were looking at plastic guards. Could be more of their spin though. Also considering they don't seem to know how to match some colours / finishes between metal and plastic - then this might just make their problems worse.

Bossxr8 · 07-02-2010, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

Fair enough (ford has said no lpg territory before....like i noted maybe canabilise diesel sales anway.

BUT, then is the question, why would you go for more towing capacity? it tows what 2.4 tonne now, so unless surveys are showing people want to tow more then?? So increase it to 3tonne (anything less than that increase is not worth the investment...).

I don't get it unless the mod is very very simple/cheap and/or is part of a wider repositioning/model option RE diesel and possibly some sort of high rider kit for off road work. I suppose with diesel coming along ford thinks it can go after prado etc. owners that only use their cars for highway/gravel work but tow larger loads (e.g. caravans)....

Its a conundrem my dad had to deal with. His Territory could only tow 2300kg legally, and his caravan weighed around that, but filling the water tanks and packing food, clothes etc would have pushed it over that. He had to sell it and buy a Prado that can tow 2500kg.

He mentioned this to one of the PD engineers we spotted up in the high country testing TD Territorys, and said he would have bought a TD Territory if it could tow 2500kg. So i'd say its not that uncommon, and many people will look to buy TD Territorys as tow vehicles. Its a smart move in my opinion, because it will then match the Prado.

phillyc · 07-02-2010, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Its a conundrem my dad had to deal with. His Territory could only tow 2300kg legally, and his caravan weighed around that, but filling the water tanks and packing food, clothes etc would have pushed it over that. He had to sell it and buy a Prado that can tow 2500kg.

He mentioned this to one of the PD engineers we spotted up in the high country testing TD Territorys, and said he would have bought a TD Territory if it could tow 2500kg. So i'd say its not that uncommon, and many people will look to buy TD Territorys as tow vehicles. Its a smart move in my opinion, because it will then match the Prado.

If that is what the market wants, then it's great to see Ford responding! A conquest sale is great because it adds to Ford's sales, takes from the opposition and lifts market share

Road_Warrior · 07-02-2010, 02:06 PM

Yeah I was gonna say it was probably more to do with matching its competitor's towing capacity more than anything else.

**Elks** · 07-02-2010, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

Really? This is exactly what BF was. A 'Facelift' to coincide with Euro III.

So Mr Paxton we are in agreement then??

Also am I the only person the thinks a coyote v8 with its bags of torque (600mn from memory) would make a good engine for the territory. Would make towing 2500kg a breeze.

banarcus · 07-02-2010, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elks

Also am I the only person the thinks a coyote v8 with its bags of torque (600mn from memory) would make a good engine for the territory. Would make towing 2500kg a breeze.

No, I've suggested it. If only Ford would build a true X5 competitor for Australians...

**Elks** · 07-02-2010, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by banarcus

No, I've suggested it. If only Ford would build a true X5 competitor for Australians...

Cool, we are the lost souls Burke & Wills style.

I know fuel consumption is the issue. But that doesn't seem to stop Toyota selling a bizillion Land Cruisers, 10% of which head off road.

**Luke Plaizier** · 07-02-2010, 10:26 PM

Would require them allowing the factory fitment of wheels greater than 18" and thicker than chitty chitty bang bangs tyres.

Those 18" rims were, in my mind, one of the major reasons why the F6X wasn't received that well.

Lukeyson

Brazen · 07-02-2010, 11:19 PM

Towing capacity increase would be fantastic. At the moment a Territory has the same rating as my AU2 Fairmont.

Found out today that the 90s Cadillac Fleetwood sedan had a 3.2 tonne towing capacity with the optional 'trailering' package. It probably weighed as much as a Landcruiser though.

I think the Territory having a 2.6tonne rating would be good to advertise as a bigger tow rating than a prado.

Road_Warrior · 08-02-2010, 12:22 PM

Guys remember that the vehicles you are comparing the Territory to (in terms of towing capacity) are all body on frame construction, whilst the Territory is unibody. Unitary body construction places a pretty big restriction on its maximum towing capacity.

Swordsman88 · 08-02-2010, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Guys remember that the vehicles you are comparing the Territory to (in terms of towing capacity) are all body on frame construction, whilst the Territory is unibody. Unitary body construction places a pretty big restriction on its maximum towing capacity.

Valid point. Given most of its soft road competitors (unitary) do not have greater towing capability (if not less) then i couldn't really see the point. Given ford no longer has explorer (which has gone unitary anyway for the newmodel) they are trying to use the diesel territory esp as a way to widen its appeal and open up new ground that they don't currently compete in.

Given the new explorer would want to keep some of its capabilities despite being unitary (e.g. towing capacity) maybe Ford Aus has had a peak at the rear end design of the new Explorer and sussed out some improvements to Territory RE strengthening etc.....

csv8 · 08-02-2010, 04:36 PM

Land Rover is unibody, and can tow 3.5tonne. No reason FORD cann't engineer Tezza to tow 2.6tonne.
In 2003 the Range Rover saw its latest design change. Much of this new design came not in its appearance but in what is found underneath the hood. The new Land rover uses a unibody construction, which was engineered by BMW when it had owned Land Rover in the latter part of the twentieth century. The vehicle also boasts a fully independent suspension. These modifications made to the vehicle have enhanced its performance when driving on pavements, giving a more comfortable ride and controlled handling. There is no loss in the vehicles all terrain ability due to the new engineering changes. The latest range Rover comes as a four door, five-seater SUV.

**Elks** · 08-02-2010, 05:51 PM

VW Toureg has a 3.0 tonne tow capacity, and Im pretty sure thats also a unibody.

**Elks** · 08-02-2010, 06:06 PM

And another thing.

A redesign of the tailgate would be good,

Option 1 - Fix the top section so that it, sounds like it closes properly. Ours always sounds flimsy and awful. To be fair it never leaked water or dust, even in the outback.

Option 2 redesign the lower tailgate to a drop down (think X5, Rangie or XB style) rather than lift up current arrangement

Just a thought.

Ghiadude · 08-02-2010, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elks

And another thing.

A redesign of the tailgate would be good,

Option 1 - Fix the top section so that it, sounds like it closes properly. Ours always sounds flimsy and awful. To be fair it never leaked water or dust, even in the outback.

Option 2 redesign the lower tailgate to a drop down (think X5, Rangie or XB style) rather than lift up current arrangement

Just a thought.

I like the tailgate design to be honest - agreed it does sound flimsy but then again so do a lot of other tailgates

jpd80 · 08-02-2010, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csv8

Land Rover is unibody, and can tow 3.5tonne. No reason FORD cann't engineer Tezza to tow 2.6tonne.

Not true, Land Rover Discovery is an Integrated Body Frame - not unitary construction.

Here's the difference:

Quote:

In the IBF the body, the engine bay and passenger compartment is built as a monocoque,
which is mated to a basic ladder-chassis holding the gearbox and suspension. It claimed to
combine the virtues of both systems, but does make the Discovery 3 uncommonly heavy
for its size stunting on-road performance and off-road agility, especially in soft ground such as sand.

Road_Warrior · 08-02-2010, 07:04 PM

And I would imagine the Touareg and Land Rover (does he mean Range Rover) weigh a buttload more than the Territory and have a driveline and reinforced components to match, not passenger car drivelines and componentry.