E Series??? - Page 6

**russellw** · 26-07-2007, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psycho Chicken

One would expect members would be informed of such action being taken against them, rather than being left hanging.

They are informed - the area made available to them has an explanatory thread so they are not left hanging as you put it - if you have been advised otherwise then you have been misinformed.

Your request has been actioned.

Russ

Bipolar · 26-07-2007, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BI6TIM

This message has been deleted by MotherNature. Reason: Matter taken up in private

Quote:

Originally Posted by russellw

Admin has changed this - the thread is here for open discussion.

Russ

Doesn't taking up matters in private defeat the purpose of Russ's post above? Usually deleted posts have an expanation as to why i.e "Not on topic". Only due of the nature of this thread, does "Matter taken up in private" translate to me as "Hiding information". As BI6TIM is an E-Series Board Member, and from reading many of his posts in the past, would I assume he would have thought about his post and the wording of it before clicking on Submit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatos

Also, perhaps they could have consulted with the likes of EFFalcon before removing his status as moderator, as I have no doubt in my mind that just because he is a moderator on the new forum, does not impact in any way on his ability to moderate these forums.

Agreed.

**russellw** · 26-07-2007, 09:30 AM

Hi Dave

Thanks for the balanced POV.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatos

What seems painfully obvious to me, however, is that the members of the e-series section now require their own T&C, because they seek to have forums that are TRULY their own. They have expanded beyond what the scope of the AFF T&C allows them to do (whether for good or bad).
So, the simple solution as I see it is that they need their own forums, run their way, whether this is hosted on AFF or not is up to AFF Admin I guess.
There needs to be a 'newbie' section for all the same BS questions over and over, as well as an 'Older Members' section where the older members can talk and relax without being bombarded with the same boring all the time.

Back in post #125 I floated the idea of doing something along these lines with a more relaxed T&C in a non public area although not too many have actually commented on the concept. We are discussing mechanisms as an admin group that would allow this to be done in a simple manner as the overall concept makes sense.
Likewise, we have created the areas that exist now at the request of your board and if someone wants to suggest changes similar to what you have outlined I can see no reason why they wouldn't be implemented.

It may, perhaps, be beneficial to start a new thread discussing how this might be structured rather than continue it in here where it may get lost in the rest of the discussion but in essence the structure of the club forums is up to the club as it is for any other. As your club is represented by a Board these suggestions should be discussed with them so that they can propose a suitable format to us. We are happy to be involved in that discussion naturally.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatos

The appointment of the new moderators for the E-series section by the AFF Admin is just a perfect example of how the AFF Admin ruling over the E-series is touching a nerve. The AFF Admin have every right to do this, however I'm sure, as part of the gentlemen's agreement, they could have made more effort to consult the E-series Board, instead of just the one remaining moderator. Also, perhaps they could have consulted with the likes of EFFalcon before removing his status as moderator, as I have no doubt in my mind that just because he is a moderator on the new forum, does not impact in any way on his ability to moderate these forums.

As you have noted, the gentlemen's agreement would normally not see us doing anything other than retaining veto rights over a club nominated moderator rather than making appointments of our own but the circumstances we faced on this occasion were somewhat different. Each of the two individuals who were removed from moderator roles were advised by PM or email and only one even took the time to reply. From my view, the issue with EFFaclon is rather more his administrator role there rather than any moderation role and he has been advised of that concern.

One of the outcomes from the Board meeting last night was that we have made some further changes to the moderation of this forum with the Board making some recommendations that we have implemented and we can only hope that this dialogue will lead to a better understanding between AFF admin and the e-series board that will enable us to improve what has sometimes been a troubled relationship.

Regards
Russ

**russellw** · 26-07-2007, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bipolar

Doesn't taking up matters in private defeat the purpose of Russ's post above? Usually deleted posts have an expanation as to why i.e "Not on topic". Only due of the nature of this thread, does "Matter taken up in private" translate to me as "Hiding information".

Hi mate

In this particular instance I agree with the action that has been taken by MN - it was actually a Board matter that he was not aware of because he had been unable to attend the meeting last night.

I have stated that nothing will be hidden in this thread (as I think the content shows) and that remains the case.

Cheers
Russ

MotherNatureVer2 · 26-07-2007, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bipolar

Doesn't taking up matters in private defeat the purpose of Russ's post above? Usually deleted posts have an expanation as to why i.e "Not on topic". Only due of the nature of this thread, does "Matter taken up in private" translate to me as "Hiding information". As BI6TIM is an E-Series Board Member, and from reading many of his posts in the past, would I assume he would have thought about his post and the wording of it before clicking on Submit.

In this instance unfortunately Tim wasnt at the meeting where this matter was discussed. I didnt think it prudent to make that a public announcement but I am now as the question has arisen.

holmsy · 26-07-2007, 10:03 AM

well russellw i for one have allways thought eseries should have their own forums on their own site to create a bit more of a club feel. but having talked to one of the board members of eseries i have been told the idea was brought up and shot down.

**russellw** · 26-07-2007, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by holmsy

well russellw i for one have allways thought eseries should have their own forums on their own site to create a bit more of a club feel. but having talked to one of the board members of eseries i have been told the idea was brought up and shot down.

I believe you will find that that idea was "shot down" internally by your Board not by the AFF admin team as I am certainly not aware of that suggestion having been made to us. Perhaps you might like to check your source and let us all know.

Cheers
Russ

holmsy · 26-07-2007, 10:33 AM

yeh i believe it was within the eseries board not aff.

**Polyal** · 26-07-2007, 10:45 AM

What I find odd is the frustration at the "n00b" posts. Its a fact of forum life that this will happen, and will continue to happen. The search feature can be rather constricting and its just alot easier to make a new thread. Most of the time these people are new to the whole forum thing anway.

And the members that dont like the threads dont have to post or comment; chances are they asked the exact same questions when they started.

I think the idea of a private e series section seems to be the best solution (similar to how the DM section works perhaps?). Also having a n00b section will help clear up the "general" area. Hell even make an e series "bar" for those who just want to talk about nothingness.

All the good suggestions have yet to be commented on, and they all work, its only if people want to make it happen. Not that it matters much to me as I dont have an e series anymore (hasn't even been a week yet though).

When I first joined the clan, the likes of MADNC_8 and NZ helped me so much, more than anyone could have, and amazing considering I was some random in need of help. I now consider those guys good friends and I would help them whenever I can (there are plenty others btw).

That is what made/makes the e series so good, the willingness for people to help. Fair enough we all get busier as we get older, but to have that back would be great.

holmsy · 26-07-2007, 10:48 AM

madnc_8 +1
and mrcrackers.
both helped me out and madnc_8 still gets me bitching on msn with stupid assed questions

it really is members like them that make it good coming onto a new forum. when people put forward their experience to help those of us that know bugger all.

mcflux · 26-07-2007, 10:52 AM

For repeated thread topics created by new members I do a quick search, and post the URLs to related threads plus make a suggestion for the new member to use the search button.

For members (new or otherwise) that then go on and continue to repeat old topics with new threads, I tend to go on the attack. ThoR_ for example was my latest victim, and he's hardly a new member.

**Polyal** · 26-07-2007, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

For repeated thread topics created by new members I do a quick search, and post the URLs to related threads plus make a suggestion for the new member to use the search button.

For members (new or otherwise) that then go on and continue to repeat old topics with new threads, I tend to go on the attack. ThoR_ for example was my latest victim, and he's hardly a new member.

LOL Dave, there are always exceptions.

Its good that you link them up, alot just post that little similie saying repost (-->>this bugger

: ) and leave it at that..WTF? :togo:

**russellw** · 26-07-2007, 11:00 AM

I have started a discussion thread on some potential changes to the structure of this area within the Board area so we shall see what comes of that. At this point we are open to any suggestions but the present gist of my thoughts is to add a newbie area, a help required area and a senior members forum that would operate in a similar manner to the DM area in terms of the posting rules being more relaxed.

However, these are only suggestions at this stage.

Cheers
Russ

Quasi · 26-07-2007, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MotherNature

I am all for a discussion of values and personal ideas. All I ask is that we keep name calling and mud slinging out of what can be a productive discussion.

Agreed.....this thread is nothing more than an online embarassement to anyone with at least half a brain, who is here because of thier enjoyment of E series Fords.

Most of you should stop trying to have the last word, and just simply grow up.

I should be surprised that there are 7 pages of this rubbish, but it's a sad state of affairs that I'm not.

**Polyal** · 26-07-2007, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quasi

Agreed.....this thread is nothing more than an online embarassement to anyone with at least half a brain, who is here because of thier enjoyment of E series Fords.

Most of you should stop trying to have the last word, and just simply grow up.

I should be surprised that there are 7 pages of this rubbish, but it's a sad state of affairs that I'm not.

True, but its at the point where something has to be done.

It seems a shame that some have decided to burn their bridges. Sunny, what you said was fair enough from your POV, but if you said it in not such an attacking way then it would have been fine.

So perhaps we should focus on what can and should be done to help the situation. Russ and myself posted suggestions, and thats all they are. It would be good if others did the same as they will have different ideas on how it should work.

Basically copy all the good bits of AFF, and make a mini AFF (the e series section/club) within AFF. If that makes sense.

mcflux · 26-07-2007, 11:16 AM

7 pages of rubbish? Many of the posts in this thread have been a debate regarding AFF moderation and the E-Series Owners Club.

alleyezonme · 26-07-2007, 11:52 AM

wow, so much ing and bickering and its still going on and whats its acheiving just more frustration and stupid remarks and ppl jumping to defence etc.
you are all supposed to be grown ppl and im not seeing that. i think its great its open to here everyone points but i think some ppl are going about it in the wrong way.
i think and im sure alot of others do to, a decision needs to be made on what is going to happen.

**Polyal** · 26-07-2007, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alleyezonme

wow, so much ing and bickering and its still going on and whats its acheiving just more frustration and stupid remarks and ppl jumping to defence etc.
you are all supposed to be grown ppl and im not seeing that. i think its great its open to here everyone points but i think some ppl are going about it in the wrong way.
i think and im sure alot of others do to, a decision needs to be made on what is going to happen.

Yeap, but you cant make a decision if no one is going to comment and give options. Hopefully thats whats going to happen next, I think everyone has had their fair share thus far.

LTDHO · 26-07-2007, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatos

Ok, probably many of you won't remember / know me as I haven't posted here for quite some time (due to my own reasons).

Welcome back mate

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatos

However I have not missed a thread that has been posted in here, or for that matter when we were at FF.com or even when we were at i8.com. I have been a moderator here and on FF.com, and was the acting vice president for this club for quite a number of years. I am also a member on the new e a f a l c o n.com forums.

The e-series forums, as long as it is part of AFF, is governed by AFF Admin. Simple as that. There is a gentleman's agreement between the AFF Admin and the E-series Admin that the E-series Admin can have a fair amount of control over their forums, but it's just that: a gentleman's agreement. At the end of the day, the AFF Admin have the last say because it is their site.
I have known all of the 'evil' banned members for many years, have socialised with many of them outside of club, and consider many of them to be great people and friends. However, the fact is that I have personally witnessed some of them break AFF T&C and recieve many warnings before being banned.
Whilst I don't agree with losing such valued members, the fact is that some of them pushed the limits of the T&C and as such paid the price. And because the e-series section is governed by AFF rules, they were punished according to the AFF rules, which is rightly so.
Having said that, I can understand why many of them have done so - sheer frustration! They have been frustrated at the same BS posts that seem to occur and the same idiots posting the same crap over and over. And seeing as they are long standing members, I know many of them have witnessed this also. I have personally witnessed the slow decline into the boring, same-old-same-old threads all the time, and I can understand their frustration.
What seems painfully obvious to me, however, is that the members of the e-series section now require their own T&C, because they seek to have forums that are TRULY their own. They have expanded beyond what the scope of the AFF T&C allows them to do (whether for good or bad).
So, the simple solution as I see it is that they need their own forums, run their way, whether this is hosted on AFF or not is up to AFF Admin I guess.
There needs to be a 'newbie' section for all the same BS questions over and over, as well as an 'Older Members' section where the older members can talk and relax without being bombarded with the same boring all the time.
The appointment of the new moderators for the E-series section by the AFF Admin is just a perfect example of how the AFF Admin ruling over the E-series is touching a nerve. The AFF Admin have every right to do this, however I'm sure, as part of the gentlemen's agreement, they could have made more effort to consult the E-series Board, instead of just the one remaining moderator. Also, perhaps they could have consulted with the likes of EFFalcon before removing his status as moderator, as I have no doubt in my mind that just because he is a moderator on the new forum, does not impact in any way on his ability to moderate these forums.

Cheers,
Dave

Well said.

It seems with almost every post there is a whinge.
The simple general rul applies, if you don't have anything constructive to post, don't post. You will then find the BS will drop and this place will be nice to be at.

Bipolar · 26-07-2007, 12:31 PM

Ditto. Not every post needs a response.

Quote:

Originally Posted by russellw

I have started a discussion thread on some potential changes to the structure of this area within the Board area so we shall see what comes of that. At this point we are open to any suggestions but the present gist of my thoughts is to add a newbie area, a help required area and a senior members forum that would operate in a similar manner to the DM area in terms of the posting rules being more relaxed.

I think this is great idea. Give only E-Series Owners Club members access to their own area with a warning about content. Then if someone doesn't agree with the content, they have the option not to participate.

It will push things forward if everyone starts discussion on this topic (future) instead of what's been happening (past).

**Polyal** · 26-07-2007, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bipolar

Ditto. Not every post needs a response.

I think this is great idea. Give only E-Series Owners Club members access to their own area with a warning about content. Then if someone doesn't agree with the content, they have the option not to participate.

It will push things forward if everyone starts discussion on this topic (future) instead of what's been happening (past).

Agreed. It would be good to hear from Needfordspeed (and Sunny, but I think he just shot himself in the foot again, he had a prefect opportunity then), Gunns etc.

mcflux · 26-07-2007, 01:10 PM

You missed Sunny's post under the username phillay. The post itself was good, but I'd suspect it was removed due to Sunny being banned (rather than the post content itself), and AFF admin not wanting banned members to continue posting, no matter what the content.

**Sorted** · 26-07-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

7 pages of rubbish? Many of the posts in this thread have been a debate regarding AFF moderation and the E-Series Owners Club.

And every 2nd or 3rd Post is from POLYAL

:

nommic · 26-07-2007, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

You missed Sunny's post under the username phillay. The post itself was good, but I'd suspect it was removed due to Sunny being banned (rather than the post content itself), and AFF admin not wanting banned members to continue posting, no matter what the content.

I saw it too, the content itself wasn't all that bad, maybe a little bit of a personal attack but basically it was Sunny defending himself.

Maybe the AFF admins could allow Sunny and other recently banned members to post only in this thread? Of course they would still have to abide by the site T&C. It would certainly help move along discussion, instead of the current fractured arguments that are going on.

fiery · 26-07-2007, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nommic

IMaybe the AFF admins could allow Sunny and other recently banned members to post only in this thread? Of course they would still have to abide by the site T&C. It would certainly help move along discussion, instead of the current fractured arguments that are going on.

I have to agree with your post, but they would have to keep all attacks to their own site and not here whilst it was in discussion. I don't know what mods and admin would think of it, but it seems like the only way to get things moving along and settled. Good idea.

**Polyal** · 26-07-2007, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRHEMI

And every 2nd or 3rd Post is from POLYAL

:

Perhaps you have a short term memory problem, I was/am/whatever part of the club; just trying to be constructive. Ill happily shut my trap until the others speak.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

You missed Sunny's post under the username phillay. The post itself was good, but I'd suspect it was removed due to Sunny being banned (rather than the post content itself), and AFF admin not wanting banned members to continue posting, no matter what the content.

I saw it, and you suspect or know? I reckon admin would have left it, it was ok expect for the last bit about spitting; how was that good? I understand he was sticking up for himself, but there are ways of going about it. Danny's post actually didn't name anyone it was a general comment; I really did want to hear from Sunny.

Gunns · 26-07-2007, 01:33 PM

I think have an eseries area for member only would be a great idea would keep the BS level down in the more public aeras.

thats my 2c

I'm Kent Bockman

Gunns · 26-07-2007, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Danny's post actually didn't name anyone it was a general comment; I really did want to hear from Sunny.

It did not name anyone, but it was aimed at certian people and anyone that has been around long enough would know who it was aimed at.

**Sorted** · 26-07-2007, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Perhaps you have a short term memory problem, I was/am/whatever part of the club; just trying to be constructive. Ill happily shut my trap until the others speak.ok.

Just an observation, I have not read this entire thread as I dont have time to but just be glancing through your name pops up alot..........

If any one comments you have to reply to it.......

Lets just leave it at that, no need to reply to this message BACK ON TOPIC

mcflux · 26-07-2007, 01:53 PM

I suspect, like I said ;)

Based on the comment towards Danny, one could assume that if admin wanted the rest of the post remaining they would've modified it Rollin-style by removing the offending line.

But this is all speculation.