Performance Ranger. Wise move or sales disaster?

naddis01 · 29-01-2012, 01:10 AM

As we all know dual cab utes seem to be on the rise in popularity in recent times. Back in 03/04 4x4 utes were accounting for around 6% of the market. In early 2011 they were accounting for around 12% of the market. So it had me thinking, the 4x4 ute market seems to be growing in popularity as now they are viewed as the family all rounder so is there room for a performance variant?

Many of the models on the market today have been recently updated or will be soon so would they be suitable for something like a Coyote or Miami V8? I know Toyota tried it with their TRD Hilux but would the Ranger have more luck going the V8 route?

Anyway what do you think? Obviously it wouldn't be for taking to the track but more along the lines of tough workhorse.

Kryton · 29-01-2012, 01:14 AM

No.
Most 4x4 buyers want Diesel.

Nic85 · 29-01-2012, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davway

No.
Most 4x4 buyers want Diesel.

This.

The reason 4x4 utes are so popular is because, like you said, they are versatile. 5 seats, room in the back for shopping, pram etc. Most now are safe (new Ranger scores 5 star ANCAP), with all the ABS/EBD/ASC acronyms thrown in, but most importantly, most of them are 4 cylinder (cheap rego) and diesel (good on fuel). You take away the fuel economy and they're about as useful as a one armed brick layer in Baghdad.

**Dave R** · 29-01-2012, 01:24 AM

You can add an instant 50% to any sales projections, seeing as atleast half of them will be rolled/written off and require replacement. Much like the TRD Hilux.

But seriously, it would be a sales disaster. Imagine how much they would need to charge for each unit. 60 kay?

OzJavelin · 29-01-2012, 01:25 AM

They'd be as successful as their predecessor .. the Cross8 ..

nstg8a · 29-01-2012, 02:06 AM

why was the trd hilux a flop? just too dear?

Nic85 · 29-01-2012, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nstg8a

why was the trd hilux a flop? just too dear?

It used 20L/100km.

**Polyal** · 29-01-2012, 02:41 AM

Ive mentioned this previously too. A V8 Ranger would be the ultimate, room of a Territory with a tray, and a V8 note and power. How is that a bad thing? It would be like a local version of the SVT Raptor minus the jumping etc.

There is not one other pickup with a V8 in Oz...I reckon it would munch SS and get the odl XR8 ute sales back.

Certainly worth a crack.

FPV GTHO · 29-01-2012, 02:51 AM

I think a better bet would be the Lion TDi V8. 246kw and 700nm.

Nic85 · 29-01-2012, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Ive mentioned this previously too. A V8 Ranger would be the ultimate, room of a Territory with a tray, and a V8 note and power. How is that a bad thing? It would be like a local version of the SVT Raptor minus the jumping etc.

There is not one other pickup with a V8 in Oz...I reckon it would munch SS and get the odl XR8 ute sales back.

Certainly worth a crack.

There are numerous problems. The first being the dollar outlay to make it work. Development costs for the engine to fit, bellhousing modifying for the gearbox, jigs and robots for assembly at the plant. So you outlay all this money, then sell probably 50/month, at best.

On the other hand, if as the post above me suggests, they put a V8 diesel into it with those sort of power and torque figures, with a 6 speed auto, I know at least one person who would buy one immediately. The lack of a proper tow vehicle sold in Australia (3.5 tonne for a 200 series Cruiser is about as good as it gets) really sucks. My old man is in the situation ATM where he wants to be able to tow a 3.5 tonne caravan, put an Argo in the tray of the ute, and have a dual cab. It's simply not possible unless you spend $80k+ on an F250/Silverado.

**buggerlugs** · 29-01-2012, 08:03 AM

I have a mate putting the Silverado diesel V8 motors coupled with Alison Auto to Nissan Patrols and Landcruisers. Cost around 25-30 k. He doesn't even advertise his service. All word of mouth. Awesome towing vehicles plus great economy. He has a waiting list a mile long..............

wrongwaynorris · 29-01-2012, 08:52 AM

Cannot see the fascination for a hotted up commercial vehicle . Even utes like Falcons and Commodores , no matte what you do they will always be a commercial vehicle .

chevypower · 29-01-2012, 08:56 AM

The 3.5 EcoBoost V6 makes the most sense. Even in the F150, it does 0-60(100km/h) in 6.5, and gets 2mpg better than the 4.0 V6 Navara/Frontier. What can it do to the Ranger? The 3.5 EB has lower upfront cost than a diesel, diesel-like torque, and amazing acceleration.

PHANTMXR6 · 29-01-2012, 09:35 AM

What target audience is the Wildtrak pitched at?

I would have thought this to be the closest 'performance' Ranger in the field.

Polyal, are you forgetting the Toyota Landcruiser ute? While not performance it is a v8 pickup isn't it?

naddis01 · 29-01-2012, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

You can add an instant 50% to any sales projections, seeing as atleast half of them will be rolled/written off and require replacement. Much like the TRD Hilux.

But seriously, it would be a sales disaster. Imagine how much they would need to charge for each unit. 60 kay?

People are paying $60k now for a Wildtrak.

They could base it on XLT spec in a similar vein to XR6 and XR6 turbo. The XR6 Turbo is not the top spec vehicle in the range.

jpd80 · 29-01-2012, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chevypower

The 3.5 EcoBoost V6 makes the most sense. Even in the F150, it does 0-60(100km/h) in 6.5, and gets 2mpg better than the 4.0 V6 Navara/Frontier. What can it do to the Ranger? The 3.5 EB has lower upfront cost than a diesel, diesel-like torque, and amazing acceleration.

US EPA combined fuel economy numbers are about 20% "thirstier" than Euro Combined ratiings for the same vehicles.
Using that yard stick, an Ecoboost F150 4 x4 would have an approximate Euro Combined of around 11.3 l/100 km
Where as the Landcruiser V8 diesel is rated at 10.3 l/100 km, although the Ford's engine would be less costly....

It would be interesting to see Ford have a go.......

The Stylist · 29-01-2012, 10:16 AM

I'd love to see a more performance and luxury orientated 3.0 V6 diesel version pitched right at the top (this engine could be used in the Wildtrak too), maybe as a Titanium/platinum model line?

Chuck in as much smart tech as possible like Sync, Park Assist, Lane Departure Warning, Adaptive cruise and a more upscale interior. The latter I'd chuck in heated leather seats (with different colour options) with full elec adjustment for driver & passenger, plus more upscale chrome/piano black bits and pieces.

Maybe a bit more chrome on the outside, i.e. window sills, lower front bumper and possibly the wheels?
I know I'm dreaming a tad but it would be great to see a full fruit ute without having look across to the USA.

babyf6 · 29-01-2012, 10:18 AM

I reckon it could go either way just as long as they don't market it like the current falcon

jpd80 · 29-01-2012, 10:53 AM

These day,everyone is focusing on good fuel economy with reasonable performance.

Any HiPo model is going to carry premium price and with that, very small numbers..

Territory is but one example of a manufacturer sitting on its hands for four years while everyone switched to diesel,
once the switch was made, people started buying Territory again, all thanks to the higher priced diesel versions..

**russellw** · 29-01-2012, 11:03 AM

Certainly diesel sales haven't harmed the Territory but the main reason for the sales resurgence was simply the refresh of, what had become, a tired looking vehicle.

As noted above, the addition of a V8 to the Ranger is simply a niche market thing and unlikely to justify the development costs. If, however, the thing takes off in the good old USA, then expect a V8 version quicker than you can say Lightning.

Cheers
Russ

nstg8a · 29-01-2012, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by russellw

Certainly diesel sales haven't harmed the Territory but the main reason for the sales resurgence was simply the refresh of, what had become, a tired looking vehicle.

cant agree with that, diesel sales are running at what, 80% of terri' sales? thats says to me the diesel is the big selling point.

mik · 29-01-2012, 11:14 AM

Jpd80 is on the money i think, and unrest oversea`s i`m sure is in the back of a lot of peoples minds........... Iran threatening to block oil supply, Europe /US in financial poop,
imo the latter is why big cars have taken such a big dive, the last 5 years ........year upon year we`ve had some potential crisis over sea`s threatening(here too), be it economic or something else, majority of people are spending less buying more frugal vehicles just in case.

**DJM83** · 29-01-2012, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Ive mentioned this previously too. A V8 Ranger would be the ultimate, room of a Territory with a tray, and a V8 note and power. How is that a bad thing? It would be like a local version of the SVT Raptor minus the jumping etc.

There is not one other pickup with a V8 in Oz...I reckon it would munch SS and get the odl XR8 ute sales back.

Certainly worth a crack.

I agree.

jpd80 · 29-01-2012, 12:13 PM

The SS Ute is basically a 2-door IRS coupe by stealth and that is the market Holden is exploiting, all the people wanting an SS for $40K.
While Ford and Holden Ute sales may seem "close" holden sells four times as many V8s as Ford sells I-6 turbos, that's a huge difference!

**buggerlugs** · 29-01-2012, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nstg8a

cant agree with that, diesel sales are running at what, 80% of terri' sales? thats says to me the diesel is the big selling point.

Spot on. If I was in the market for a Territory I wouldn't even consider the petrol model..........

jpd80 · 29-01-2012, 12:42 PM

In heavier vehicles, diesels make more sense due to the increased payback
in actual fuel saved, big savings to be had in SUVs and larger sedans...

Good thing about diesel Vs LPG, diesel vehicles usually have much lower CO2
levels because they burn much less fuel..Important with Carbon tax here soon

FPV GTHO · 29-01-2012, 06:15 PM

Problem with putting in an ecoboost v6 is you leave a product gap by not offering a standard v6 beneath it. If you want ecoboost maybe wait for the Nano V6

lockieoc · 29-01-2012, 06:20 PM

Performance diesels are the way to go. take the V12 TDi in the Audi Q7 for example

500BHP
1000NM
0-100 in 5.5sec
11.5l/100km (tests vary some have claimed 9.5l)
this is a car that weighs 2.6T!

What more could you want from such a car??.. except maybe a reasonable price tag

(you will be paying $250000 for one)

Just look how easily this guy over takes these cars

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tt1wH...eature=related

Thats real world performance right there!

So why bother with a petrol when diesels have so much potential.

**Luke Plaizier** · 29-01-2012, 06:33 PM

It's certainly not a dumb question.

There's a V8 Landcruiser / Lexus after all. A V8 Range Rover. Why wouldn't it work in a Ford if it was the top spec level? Or does it need a different badge - like Lincoln?

Too Many People Saying No is the only problem I see here.

Having said all that, I do think a large-capacity Hi-Po Diesel would be awesome.

Lukeyson

mash again · 29-01-2012, 06:40 PM

real world figures for a 76 series or 79 series v8 landcruiser is more like 14l/100km. was doing 3000km a month for work and mostly at 80km/hr or over, and if you use the perforemance that a performance diesel can give it will chew fuel just the same. people buy diesel because they think its cheaper to run, if you could buy a 120kw petrol territory bet that would be good on fuel aswell.