Australia - China - Poltics - Page 14

**DJR-351** · 24-04-2021, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

You can only project so far. I say rip it up and buy it back

I understand our diplomacy has not been great, but just remember that all we asked for was an investigation which the whole world wanted and they chucked a massive dummy spit.

They responded by economic pressure because they didn't like that.

The aggrieved can project as far as they want, whether they get compensated for it or not will likely be a decision for the courts because that is exactly where it would end up, dragging on for years.

I'd like to see it ripped up to, I don't want any part of Australia or Australian business owned by any foreign interests, but as we have proven time after time we will sell anything to anyone for the right price, but just because it doesn't suit us now doesn't mean we can just rip up all the done deals, it's just not that simple and easy.....which is my point

Let's not forget no Federal body has oversight of Australian ports, which are the domain of state and territory governments (since tightened up by the Feds to ensure national security issues are considered).....it was the NT Govt that sold and received (and spent) the payment for the Port Lease, not the Feds.....who would pay it back and with who's money?

Also, albeit with only a 50% stake, the Port of Newcastle is another Australian port that has a 99-year lease with another privately owned Chinese company.

Citroënbender · 24-04-2021, 07:24 PM

There’s a problem with your graphic, comrade.

“Reasonable” seems not required upon the sign.

Tickford. · 24-04-2021, 11:20 PM

Australia's Liberal government welcomes Victoria's Belt and Road Initiative

(05/11/2018)

The Australia's trade minister has also applauded Victoria for becoming the nation's first state to sign up to the China-proposed Belt and Road Initiative (BRI).

Birmingham said the federal government welcomed more Chinese investment in the region, according to The Australian newspaper.

Victoria became the first state last month in Australia to sign a memorandum of understanding with China on the Belt and Road Initiative.

According to State Premier Daniel Andrews, the historic agreement means Victoria will be best placed in the country to capitalize on the trade and investment opportunities made possible by the global infrastructure project.

"We welcome the fact that Victoria has shown their enthusiasm and initiative," Birmingham said.

"The Australia government welcomes the fact that, through (the Belt and Road Initiative), China is investing more across our regions."

That was Simon Birmingham, Scotty from marketing's Trade Minister. Encouraged and welcomed VIC's BRI with China in 2018. How much more duplicitous can the Morrison government be?

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/201..._137583436.htm

**George V** · 24-04-2021, 11:53 PM

Fed Libs took care of one of Vic Labor's political liability;
Deep down I am sure they all love each other

Cheers,
George V

oldel · 25-04-2021, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tickford.

How much more duplicitous can the Morrison government be?

That's a bit mean ;-) The fed gov isn't supposed to show leadership or have policy, vision or strategy etc. Their job is just tax the population and spend while catering to business and donors wishes.
Nothing matters to them, the main thing is to collect influence and favour for a couple of years, then after that the next election is on the agenda anyway, so scratch something up to save yourself or bail out to land a career with your new found friends.

Just like I would advise anyone taking up Chinas help (NZ was the last one, but Pacific nations and AU states also), the problem is the fed gov is a bunch of clowns and don't know ****.

MITCHAY · 06-05-2021, 07:34 PM

China has 'retaliated'. They have made formal what they have done for ages, stopped picking up the phone.

So practically it means **** all

oldel · 06-05-2021, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

I understand our diplomacy has not been great, but just remember that all we asked for was an investigation which the whole world wanted and they chucked a massive dummy spit.

You still think this is about the comments about a covid investigation?

China has made it clear it is about huawei.
Australian intelligence fought against allowing network access as part as the 5g roll out and that had a huge effect with USA, Canada and UK all of a sudden going after huawei based on our say so.
That has cost China a lot, both is getting their product out and trusted, and probably spying.
That is why China has the massive ****s with Australia.
We banned them in 2018, and must have said something to 5 eyes to make canada look into it, US to ban them too, and UK to backflip over allowing them earlier.

That seems to be their biggest gripe. They don't like FIRB, what we say about covid, the pacific or their internal stuff sure, but they can ignore us for all that. But when we stepped into international stuff that affects their markets in other western countries, that's what set them off the most.

MITCHAY · 06-05-2021, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldel

You still think this is about the comments about a covid investigation?

China has made it clear it is about huawei.
Australian intelligence fought against allowing network access as part as the 5g roll out and that had a huge effect with USA, Canada and UK all of a sudden going after huawei based on our say so.
That has cost China a lot, both is getting their product out and trusted, and probably spying.
That is why China has the massive ****s with Australia.

Of course it's not the whole story but that is the timeline when they spat it big time.

Even so don't you think that if it was all about Huawei that it is a massive overreaction?

oldel · 06-05-2021, 08:16 PM

Not if we were right and it allows backdoors and espionage

shedcoupe · 07-05-2021, 12:09 AM

Take comfort in China's probable self-loathing - they're addicted to our iron ore and can't get their fix from other markets.
Yet.
When other dealers open their coats old mate will be in there like a rat up a drainpipe.
And then we'll be looking for that matching barbed-wire paddle.

oldel · 07-05-2021, 02:21 AM

Yeah. Walking into that eyes wide open and not doing a productive thing about it.
This gov doesn't know how to communicate - gets all messed up with a big stick approach like dumb headmasters. Much like border control issues - gets themselves so riled up on threatening with big sticks they have to walk backwards and say the threat wasn't the point/issue. No matter how hard they try they haven't got rid of foot in mouth disease.

Seriously, worst set of fed pollies we've had for a long long time. Low intellect crossed with complacency. I don't bat for the other team - my support is earned, not given - but some pollies with competence has got to find a path through this.
This time next year we will be begging for andrew ****in forrest, god help us, most state govs are better than this LNP federal mob! The fed gov don't understand much, Dan Tehan as trade minister? We're stuffed, the guy is a moron. An idiot that did nothing in education and likes shooting his mouth off on twitter!

Bossxr8 · 07-05-2021, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedcoupe

Take comfort in China's probable self-loathing - they're addicted to our iron ore and can't get their fix from other markets.
Yet.
When other dealers open their coats old mate will be in there like a rat up a drainpipe.
And then we'll be looking for that matching barbed-wire paddle.

Not enough iron ore to go around, and our reserves are the highest from what I can look at.

Not much to worry about. It's not like we can't find other markets for it. Everyone needs steel.

shedcoupe · 07-05-2021, 04:04 PM

China is trying hard to develop mines in Africa but that's a monumental task.

**FTE217** · 07-05-2021, 04:10 PM

sorry oldel, I beg to differ re our puny little influence on huawei.
Govs have been wary by the influence China is gaining due to all their OS investments and this was a major one. Another point is its not unexpected 3rd world struggling countries opening themselves to Chinas welfare handouts But I'm glad some of the major developed ones have stood up.
Concerns about security yaddayadda is a very good point of reason - I doubt the big UK/USA policy makers/leaders were that influenced by little ol scotty and his dwarfs saying no.
They may have lifted one eye for a sec but seriously.

I don't think a Gov is anywhere near as competant as it was say 50yrs ago let alone just 30. I'd be curious who rate of the past.
World is farfarfar more complicated and its shrinking.
Is there a decent Global Leader anywhere from anyside today ? let alone leading their country the way you expect them to ? Once upon a time it was about the long term, nowadays as we see its all short term. Who/where is doing a better job.
Maybe put your hand up, start up your own party being you align with no one.
Just saying - bite my head all you like I won't be offended if you bring up some valid points.

pottery beige · 07-05-2021, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedcoupe

China is trying hard to develop mines in Africa but that's a monumental task.

bingo

nibble · 07-05-2021, 04:36 PM

Looks like any attempt to attack China now would be completely futile.

https://johnmenadue.com/war-with-chi...-capabilities/

Bossxr8 · 07-05-2021, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nibble

Looks like any attempt to attack China now would be completely futile.

https://johnmenadue.com/war-with-chi...-capabilities/

Yeah, because China wouldn't put out propaganda talking up it's capabilities would it

They are well known to "leak" classified information about high tech weapons with no proof they even exist. They claimed to be ship testing magnetic rail guns, while the US Navy has been working on them for decades and have never been able to get it to last more than one shot before the heat melts the barrel. the chinese just want other countries to believe their capabilities are way more advanced than what they really are.

But no one is going to attack China anyway. It's more likely to be the other way round.

MITCHAY · 07-05-2021, 06:50 PM

Iron ore price hit US$200. I bet Josh Frydenberg is happy ahead of budget night

**Burnout** · 07-05-2021, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Iron ore price hit US$200. I bet Josh Frydenberg is happy ahead of budget night

You think so............ China is building the worlds biggest stockpile of iron ore ever seen.
Guess what happens when they reckon they have enough...............

pottery beige · 07-05-2021, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burnout

You think so............ China is building the worlds biggest stockpile of iron ore ever seen.
Guess what happens when they reckon they have enough...............

commission third world **** hole mines ??

MITCHAY · 07-05-2021, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burnout

You think so............ China is building the worlds biggest stockpile of iron ore ever seen.
Guess what happens when they reckon they have enough...............

Yes they are. Some people think they have other options but we all know they don't otherwise they would be going there.

That is short to midterm outlook, they have no option other than to lessen demand. They don't buy from us because they like it but they will cut us loose as soon as they can.

We have a nuclear option though I'm not sure we have the brains to pull it off.

I was reading such things such as restricting supply and stock piling here and in other allied countries by buying it ourselves.

Though you have to consider steel prices, debt in all that and not sure how that goes down.

nibble · 08-05-2021, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Yeah, because China wouldn't put out propaganda talking up it's capabilities would it

They are well known to "leak" classified information about high tech weapons with no proof they even exist. They claimed to be ship testing magnetic rail guns, while the US Navy has been working on them for decades and have never been able to get it to last more than one shot before the heat melts the barrel. the chinese just want other countries to believe their capabilities are way more advanced than what they really are.

But no one is going to attack China anyway. It's more likely to be the other way round.

Let's not underestimate their technological capabilities. In almost all industries they are catching up if not overtaking many competitors. Space, communications, electronics, automotive etc.., why not military? Coupled with a central controlling government with high ambition that flows down to its people you can see why they are successful.

China will most likely re-claim what they see as their rightful lands and waters (Taiwan, south china seas etc..). The ensuing conflict will be catastrophic.

**FTE217** · 13-05-2021, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nibble

Let's not underestimate their technological capabilities. In almost all industries they are catching up if not overtaking many competitors. Space, communications, electronics, automotive etc.., why not military? Coupled with a central controlling government with high ambition that flows down to its people you can see why they are successful.

China will most likely re-claim what they see as their rightful lands and waters (Taiwan, south china seas etc..). The ensuing conflict will be catastrophic.

agreed this is another piece to their domination puzzle.
Its been brewing for years, all my travels last 20yrs to China reading the China Daily and other publications has quoted their taunts and show of might towards Japan/Korea and surrounds. CCP has alot of chips on their shoulders towards Japan.
CCP quoting they can squeeze them all and take.
We, the USA and other westerners who may get involved to counter this will be in for a mighty fight.
nibble the rest as you say they are already going ahead in leaps and bounds.

Tickford. · 19-05-2021, 11:43 AM

Pelosi calls for U.S. and world leaders to boycott China's 2022 Olympics

"What I propose - and join those who are proposing - is a diplomatic boycott," Pelosi said, in which "lead countries of the world withhold their attendance at the Olympics."

"Let's not honor the Chinese government by having heads of state go to China," she added.

"For heads of state to go to China in light of a genocide that is ongoing - while you're sitting there in your seat - really begs the question, what moral authority do you have to speak again about human rights any place in the world?"

https://www.reuters.com/lifestyle/sp...na-2021-05-18/

What will our PM do? Will he have the gonads to pull the plug?

Bossxr8 · 19-05-2021, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tickford.

Pelosi calls for U.S. and world leaders to boycott China's 2022 Olympics

"What I propose - and join those who are proposing - is a diplomatic boycott," Pelosi said, in which "lead countries of the world withhold their attendance at the Olympics."

"Let's not honor the Chinese government by having heads of state go to China," she added.

"For heads of state to go to China in light of a genocide that is ongoing - while you're sitting there in your seat - really begs the question, what moral authority do you have to speak again about human rights any place in the world?"

https://www.reuters.com/lifestyle/sp...na-2021-05-18/

What will our PM do? Will he have the gonads to pull the plug?

I can't stand Pelosi, but this is the one and only thing I would ever agree with her on.

**FTE217** · 19-05-2021, 12:36 PM

She's made a great call to arms........
Scomo Gonads ? wouldn't that be the case for soso many Countries no matter the leader ?
Importantly many need to stand together on that stance and thats the gonad question for any Country, no good being a lame duck even though its moralling right, I wouldn't wish for him to make the call without having assurance many countries will stand by it together and go through with it.

Citroënbender · 19-05-2021, 12:43 PM

FTE, where do you see them (China) sitting in respect of ongoing hostage diplomacy - ramp up or stay the same?

b0son · 19-05-2021, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nibble

China will most likely re-claim what they see as their rightful lands and waters (Taiwan, south china seas etc..).

Taiwan is the key. With the overwhelming majority of computer chip production coming out of Taiwan, there's simply no way the western world will let China hold them hostage. We went to war for oil last time, looks like we may go off to war for silicon.

I didnt even realise how dependent on Taiwan the world is. I had long assumed silicon valley produced a sizeable slab of the world's silicon....

Bossxr8 · 20-05-2021, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

Taiwan is the key. With the overwhelming majority of computer chip production coming out of Taiwan, there's simply no way the western world will let China hold them hostage. We went to war for oil last time, looks like we may go off to war for silicon.

I didnt even realise how dependent on Taiwan the world is. I had long assumed silicon valley produced a sizeable slab of the world's silicon....

Probably why the US government is taking steps to increase US semi-conductor manufacturing capacity.

**FTE217** · 20-05-2021, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

FTE, where do you see them (China) sitting in respect of ongoing hostage diplomacy - ramp up or stay the same?

Good question CB, mind you I'm not privy to any political connections but major business people but I think that will be challenged when what/who really makes the moves against the CCP, such as Taiwan mentioned and the many other issues at hand.
Why I mentioned there HAS to be a collective otherwise your a sitting duck.